Danny Bloom — how long have you been in PR? “Francophobe awards”, in my humble opinion, may be seen more as an attack than as a humorous (albeit serious) reprimand.
You see, what we want is to ridicule the bashers, and make people see how ridiculous it is. We don’t want them lynched by an angry mob (besides, it’s not happening). Often, the shortest way to peoples’ hearts and minds is through laughter — laughing at the bigots, that is.
That’s why they use “chickenhawk” instead of “cowardly belligerent republicans”
I have the same take on the matter as André Wernesson. As he says, ‘You see, what we want is to ridicule the bashers, and make people see how ridiculous it is.” (and if I may add, how idiotic they, French bashers are.)
“Francophobe award” indeed lends it a serious note and is technically the appropriate term but we don’t want to make the whole enterprise seem <i>lugubre.</i>
A suggestion from one of our readers : Well…maybe the critics are are right. Maybe it should be coupled with something like the Lafayette award [or the Lafayette-Jefferson Award] for the person who has done the most to improve Franco-American relations.
“(and if I may add, how idiotic they, French bashers are.)”
Precisely. We could actually photoshop the contestants’ faces onto freedom fry “bodies”, (well, actually, French Fries with legs and arms) and make a nice page where you can visit the contestants. It would all be done in Rocky style, as if they were ready to duke it out.
If we turn french-bashers into cool cartoon characters, I’m afraid the impact will be somewhat limited.
We need to ridicule them I agree but not in the pretty mild way that you describe, andré.
I mean we’re talking people who are responsible for an entire generation of americans growing up persuaded that the French are cowards and stinky (it’s no longer a joke now for them).
That’s really serious. We need to hit them as hard as we can.
Let’s not get me wrong here: We’re going for ridiculous. If some people have no sense of humor and can’t get the joke’s on the bashers, then tough. I don’t like people without a sense of humor.
Here’s a perfect example of a hypocritical turncoat who’s trying to gloss over his anti-French hatred of yesteryear. Rush Limbaugh who used to refer to John Kerry as “French-looking” and mocking him as “Jean Cheri” or “Jean F. Cheri” now wants to be seen as pro-French.
Now this hypocrite wants to bee seen as a Francophile : “Unlike many right-wing talk-show hosts, Limbaugh does not view France with hostility. On the contrary, he is a Francophile. His salon, he told me, is meant to suggest Versailles. His main guest suite, which I did not personally inspect, was designed as an exact replica of the presidential suite of the George V Hotel in Paris. ” Source : http://reason.com/blog/show/127323.html and the New York Times
And more surrender jokes… why ? Of course, a Frenchman lost something, to a Briton !!!
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/main.jhtml?xml=/sport/2008/07/03/stmoor103.xml
“Andy Murray made a monkey of cheese-eating Frenchman Richard Gasquet at Wimbledon
By Brian Moore
Last Updated: 2:22am BST 03/07/2008
I have always said you cannot trust the French; Primates capitulards et toujours en quête de fromages (cheese-eating surrender monkeys). Just when Richard Gasquet was cruising to a three-set win against Andy Murray at Wimbledon, he goes all French and surrenders.”
So I nominate Brian Moore for this award ! 😉
“I don’t want to humor people who think my little boy stinks and is a coward and are doing everyhting they can so their own boy believe it.
It’s not a comedy rally. It’s a struggle against bigotry and injustice.”
Me neither! Remember, we’re laughing AT the bashers, not WITH them!
The fact is, if it’s people who already are anti-French, chances are, no matter how we present it, they’ll stick to their wretched ideas.
But we must win ourselves those sane people who DON’T — and the best way is not to “accuse” them (which is never appreciated) but to be more “with” them.
Look, it’s like political caricatures. You may make a caricature to denounce something which you think a certain party or politician did wrong. And it’s funny. Of course, the said politician won’t find it funny. Perhaps, neither will his party colleagues, or his die-hard factionneers. But anyone who isn’t biased will grasp it, and understand how ridiculous that politician was.
According to your reasonning, there should be no political caricatures in the papers, only grim copperplate engravings portraying the horror of what they did!
May I second that. The Britons always, no matter what, have managed to make their bashing more venomous, more offensive, more hateful. The Americans try, but lack that special touch.
OK, so here we’ve got this fine, fine example of late 19th century political cartoons, about our buddy Ulysses S Grant.
Now before we start objecting here that he’s cool because he’s portrayed as a cool trapezist or something, let’s have a look at his attributes: The president is obviously making a tremendous strain to make his whole shennanigan work — hanging onto different rings and bars such as “whiskey” and “third term” and especially, “corruption”, with a whole multitude of tiny, ridiculous carnies (his chamber members) weighing down the whole, absurd, fragile construction of state Grant has made.
Now, let’s not say this is uneffective! The ridicule, the absurdness, so plainly exposed, make it impossible to object that “This isn’t a comedy marathon; this is making corruption funny! We’re talking about a drunkard who’s spending the taxpayer’s money irresponsibly, not some cool trapezist!”
Je crois que cette fois il faudrait exiger des excuses : faire campagne, n’importe quoi, mais quelque chose. Cette fois ci, ils sont allées beaucoup trop loin : c’est autre chose que ce qu’ils font d’habitude. C’est comme si la presse française s’était mise à faire de l’humour sur les mort américains en Irak à cause des “tirs amis”, ou, comme vous l’avez écrit, sur le massacre de Virginia Tech… J’en ai la nausée. On ne doit pas rester sans réaction : ils ont franchi, ici, la dernière limite du tolérable !
Il ne faut pas exagérer, Onion Johnny, ce que tu dis est déjà arrivé. Après tout il n’y a pas eu de mort, et ça fait partie du genre satirique. Je me rappelle quand un airbus iranien avait été abattu par erreur par les Américains au dessus du golfe persique. Le Canard Enchaîné avait publié un dessin où on voyait le capitaine du porte-avion américain qui regardait l’airbus couler avec ses jumelles et disait à son second:”Il faut reconnaître que cet airbus iranien ressemble beaucoup à un airbus iranien”. Et quand Michel Droit avait tué un ami par accident dans une partie de chasse, il y avait eu une ribambelle de dessins satiriques dans le même journal.
Donc, Jean-Paul, on ne doit rien dire… A ce compte là autant faire des blagues sur les victimes du 11 septembre et leurs familles (comme Ann Coulter ?), ou pourquoi plaisanter sur la mort de soldats de la coalition, tués par des tirs amis ? Faisons cela et vous verrez la réactions des défenseurs autoproclamés de la liberté de parole qu’on trouve aux USA.
Quant au Canard Enchaîné, ses satyres, parfois déplacées, lui valent procès sur procès…
Non, les procès du Canard (qu’il gagne le plus souvent) ne concernent pratiquement jamais ses dessins. Là je rappelle que personne n’a été tué, et que les accidents de chasse ou de guerre constituent un filon assez classique pour les journaux et dessins satiriques et pour les chansonniers. Rappelons nous celui arrivé récemment à Dick Cheney. Ce n’est pas si différent. Je pense qu’ici on se ridiculiserait et qu’on ne servirait pas ici la cause qu’on prétend servir en se montrant trop pince sans rire.
Blessées par balle à Carcassonne dimanche dernier lors des journées portes ouvertes du 3e RPIMA, 6 victimes sont encore hospitalisées à Toulouse. 4 autres restent en observation dans les hôpitaux de Montpellier ou Carcassonne. 4 victimes et notamment de jeunes enfants de 4 ans et 6 ans, pourtant blessées par arme de guerre sont déjà sorties de l’hôpital. Un homme de 40 est toujours dans un état grave et sous observation intensive au Centre hospitalier de Carcassonne.
Le petit Gabriel 3 ans hospitalisé à Purpan, opéré du bras et du cœur. Réveillé mardi, re passé au bloc mercredi après-midi pour réfection du pansement était hier en fin d’après midi dans un état stable.
Le jeune Loïc 10 ans, souffre encore de plaies “pulmonaires” sont état est jugé “stable”.
Blessé à la cuisse, Mickaël 9 ans, subit encore des soins à l’hôpital Purpan.
Les autres victimes hospitalisées à Toulouse sont, physiquement, dans des états jugés satisfaisants et pourraient même sortir dans les prochains jours.
Lecteur assidu du Canard et de Charlie Hebdo, j’en ai vu des dessins et des dessins et des dessins. Certains sont outranciers, mais c’est bien le rôle du journal que de mettre en exergue nos préjugés … Ce qui est navrant avec Danziger – c’est sa basse hypocrisie car comme tous les French Bashers – il se défoule sur notre compte et dessinant ce qu’ils n’oserait jamais dessiner sur le compte des citoyens de son propre pays.
En fin de compte, la question n’est pas de désapprouver la question traitée mais de souligner l’hypocrisie par le prisme de l’Anti-Français primaire. Le politiquement correct étant un des outils à notre disposition.
Est-ce que ce monsieur s’est permi les meme caricatures ignobles lors des incidents au Camp Pendleton en 2002 et 2006 ou des Marines ont par inadvertence tué deux de leurs collègues pensant avoir chargé leur fusil de balles à blanc (exactement comme le sodat français) ?
May I add one small consideration in favor of “The Freedom Fry Award” and against “the Francophobe award” — it’s the “phobe” thing. It’s very in style lately, it basically consists in thinking that anyone who doesn’t think like one, the “phobe” in question, is obviously sick, and with a couple pills he’ll be just like us.
I’m not defending the bashers here, but I doubt these people suffer from a phobia. I think they’re assholes, period.
Onion Johnny #5 “A ce compte là autant faire des blagues sur les victimes du 11 septembre et leurs familles”
Hum… As-tu (je me permet) déjà vu le sketch de Christophe Alévêque sur le 11 septembre ? Même connaissant le style d’Alévêque très cynique et politiquement incorrect parfois et tout, y’a des choses qui ne sont sûrement pas du goût de nos amis Américains dans ce sketch…
This was just after Chirac’s reelection (sorry in French with no subtitles) so not veeeery long after 9/11. He clearly mean to be shocking “At first we heard 40 000, 45 000 dead. So we were like um wow, ok, pfiou… what do we do… do we put Champagne in the fridge ? ….”
This is a poor translation (sorry).
July 2, 2008 Compare and Contrast
Sense of Honor, French and U.S. Style
By BRIAN CLOUGHLEY
In France on June 29 a soldier taking part in a demonstration mistakenly fired live rounds instead of blanks. He wounded 17 people who were watching the display. The Chief of Staff of the French Army, General Bruno Cruche, submitted his resignation to President Sarkozy, who accepted it next day. There had been speedy analysis of a horrific incident ; immediate acceptance of responsibility ; then a self-imposed and principled end to a distinguished career by an officer who has set an example in honor and decency for generations of French soldiers. And for any others who care to take note.
Compare this incident with the aftermath of the evil scandal at Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq, where scores of Iraqis were tortured by US soldiers in the most disgusting circumstances. All the victims of casual violence, which was enjoyed so much by their torturers, as was evident from their happy photographs, were scarred for life, mentally or physically. Some were murdered in the prison; some died later. And we don’t know the half of what went on there. In 2004 US legislators were shown videos and still pictures of even more revolting and degrading atrocities than had been leaked to the public. There are scores of scenes of dreadful torture that the US administration has ordered to be kept forever secret.
A Democrat Senator said these pictures were terrible : “worse than anything I had anticipated,” but other legislators were not in any way disturbed at the agony endured by the victims of torture by American soldiers : “I’m probably not the only one up at this table that is more outraged by the outrage than we are by the treatment,” declared Republican Senator James Inhofe. (Where do they get such people from? Are they really human?) But in spite of the secrecy and the contemptible attitude of those who approve of cruel and filthy degradation of human beings, we outsiders know enough to state that the Abu Ghraib outrage was despicable and that it was indubitably carried out by the US army. But did any generals resign over this appalling affair? Nary a one, of course.
A few people were court-martialled. But most charges were reduced, dismissed, or dealt with by “non-judicial punishment” – you’ve got to laugh about that particular weasel-wording in spite of all the horror. Then a female one-star officer was reduced in rank. Apart from that : nothing – except that the officer appointed to investigate the sickening mayhem, Major General Taguba, ended his career when he recorded the truth. What a poisoned chalice he was handed : allow a cover-up and advance to three stars ; or permit the truth to be told and be destroyed for what his peculiar superiors would call “disloyalty”. And this sort of thing has continued. Countless atrocities in Iraq and Afghanistan have been denied, ignored or covered up. The conduct of US troops has only too often been horrendous to the point that the phrase “war crimes” is inadequate. The lies told by US army officers of the highest rank concerning the accidental killing of Pat Tillman by his own comrades in Afghanistan are a blot on the army’s reputation. But not one of these reptiles resigned.
What a contrast in honor with French custom. What a commentary on the different perspectives of “Old Europe” and the strange new US Army. But what on earth has happened to the code of honor of West Point? How far down has the US Army gone in its plunge (or surge?) to its seemingly unconditional acceptance of political amorality?
Fifteen years ago I attended the graduation parade at West Point of a son of close friends. Not only was it an impressive ceremony, but I, a cynical old “seen-it-all”, was damp-eyed about the attitude of the newly-commissioned young officers. They were dedicated and keen to serve their country, of course ; but there was something more. They had a tangible sense of responsibility to their calling, the Profession of Arms : they had a sense of honor. But I wonder where that is now?
The disgraced and unlamented Donald Rumsfeld, the worst secretary of defense in US history, declared about the atrocities in Abu Ghraib that “We’re functioning in a – with peacetime restraints, with legal requirements in a wartime situation, in the information age, where people are running around with digital cameras and taking these unbelievable photographs and then passing them off, against the law, to the media, to our surprise, when they had not even arrived in the Pentagon.” His public relations people quickly conjured up a new statement for him, of course ; but he had shown what he really thought. His objection was to publicity of torture; not to torture itself.
Rumsfeld’s generals said nothing. And the generals of Mr Gates, his successor, say nothing, either. Nothing about the war crimes, the deliberate killing of civilians, the evil of the prisoner cages where torture takes place. The code of West Point now seems to have gone off at a tangent from “Duty, Honor, Country”. The West Point oath that future officers will “not lie, cheat, steal, or tolerate those who do” appears to have been bent a bit. No doubt there are very few officers who would cheat or steal. But it seems there are some, and some of high rank, who lie and tolerate lying.
France’s senior soldier, General Cruche, didn’t indulge in the sort of cowardly eye-closing that seems to afflict senior US officers who know of unlawful activities in current operational theatres. He has a moral code. He knows that responsibility in the Profession of Arms rests at the top. Nowhere else. And when something terrible happened, he resigned.
Duty, Honor, Country. Brian Cloughley lives in France. His website is www.briancloughley.com
Comparing honour French and US style done no less than by a former military man who served in both the British and Australian Armies (read his short bio in his website.
[Picking up from where Miquelon.Org left, re Danziger’s cartoon mocking the French Army for the horrendous shooting demonstation that left 17 people wonded, I do think there is a need to re-calibrate issues with regard to this latest absurd and almost bigoted stereotyping/bashing of the French appearing in The New York Times.]
It is not that simple. General Cuche was on his way to retirement in summer, and many people (including myself) believe that the real reason for his resignment is the rude behaviour of the president toward him and toward the army, as well as his strong disapproval of the next budget restriction for the French army. Cuche is also believed to be quite reluctant toward Sarkozy’s policy in Afghanistan. Clearly Sarkozy has very difficult and tense relations with the military.
Whatever the sentiments of Gen Cuche vis a vis Pres Sarkozy is irrelevant on the issue of command responsibility — we may very well believe that because he is on the way out, i.e., retiring soon, got nothing to lose, etc., hence he decided to resign, etc, etc, but the bottom line is that he accepted command responsibility and handed his resignation knowing it was the only thing to do… in other words, it IS simple… all other considerations take a back seat… sense of honour for the French army is therefore INTACT!
[Gen Cruche] … has a moral code. He knows that responsibility in the Profession of Arms rests at the top. Nowhere else. And when something terrible happened, he resigned.
Sorry about the “Cruche” — my bad, I mistook our noblest general for a pitcher…
I was saying it’s about time France recovered its long-held recognition for fine acheivment in the military profession. We’re not just talking about the heroes of Borodino here, but of the seriousness, professionality and commitment of French military personnel. We’ve got some brilliant chaps in there, absolutely first class, and it’s about time they stopped getting ridiculed by ignorant chickenhawks!
Now it can be told: Bush the bully tried to bully Sarkozy last year. One may like or dislike Sarkozy but he sure showed Bush that he couldn’t bully the French.
Jesus Christ, I just saw (in Miquelon’s news tube) that terrible Sri Lanka article in which the author (coming from the most victorious, most glorious nation of Sri Lanka) says the French have always surrendered, from Vercingetorix to Napoleon III to Pétain.
Amazing…
If the fellow knew that, over so many years of war, the Gauls had lost a fourth of their population due to casualties, retaliations and Roman genocide, and Vercingetorix was the very last, futile attempt…
If the fellow knew that, rather than surrendering outright, after the disaster of Sedan was the heroic sacrifice of the Franc-tireurs, the selfless resistance in the siege of Paris, the determined attempt at re-building the army by the new republic…
If he knew of the 100,000 casualties in the first month of the battle of France…
He mentions Waterloo. Waterloo was not a surrender, it was an honest battle which was only won due to the timely arrival of Blücher, effectively outnumbering the French 2:1
And it makes one think, when petty nations such as Sri Lanka feel brave enough to spit on the history of a great country like France, and forego its numberless exploits, which make their Sri Lankan feats pale in comparison, you can really see that Big Brother (the US) has truly instilled a true sentiment of hatred and spite into their hearts…
Jeff Danziger’s response to the editorial. With kind permission.
“Sorry you feel that way. My disgust is not with the French people, but with the idiot who couldn’t tell the difference between live shells and blanks. Using to old joke about French military prowess is cheap, I admit, but there is some truth to it. They hardly distinguished themselved in World War Two, after all. I didn’t make that part up. In addition, I was not trying to say the situation was “laughable”, but certainly worth of disdain, and many French agree.
(…) For the record, I am an ardent francophile, and regularly attend the cartoon festival in St. Just-le-Martel near Limoges. I write frequently for the French site, www.courrierinternational.com
All best wishes,
Jeff Danziger”
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