Before the attacks on me for mentioning the numbers of Jews and Danes start…..Who first bought up the numbers of Jews in Denmark and France?
That would of course make people think about the total population of Denmark vis via France. Tough if people don’t like facts about difference in population between Denmark and France. The truth is very hard to handle for certain people in this site. All hell will be break loose and now the personal attacks will start ( hooray for the fascist mentality!)
Fred : “self-appointed– [term removed], striving to be identified in a taken-up…………………..Court- jew methodology works in the interests of triumphalism; ”
Time to write your own about how “Anglos” write lies about French anti-semitism. **
Ce n’était pas du tout une menace, c’était seulement pour signaler une évidence : toutes les nations ont des pages noires dans leur histoire et il est stupide de regarder les peuples qu’à travers celles-ci.
But please Sharon, continu to explain us that we have a fascist mentality, that’s very interesting…
Sharon, why don’t you come clean and tell us what country you live in. I would love to know what you have done in that country to fight anti-Americanism? You will admit the country you live in harbours a lot of anti-American sentiment?
Oh, I see the owner of the blog after telling other posters here not to talk to the “troll” has lowered himself to talk to the so called troll. Too bad, too late now to talk to me . I will take the owner’s advise and not engage trolls.
It was YOU who first mentioned the number of Jews in Denmark versus France…so does that make you a “troll” ?
I guess not, whenever the comparison is favorable to France it is not trolling but if the comparison is unfavorable to France, than it becomes “trolling”. What do we call this kind of mentality?
http://bit.ly/qlctQ
You don’t like the fact the French are the most productive people in the world ?
That’s ok. Talk about French surrender and jews and you’ll feel better.
Talk about obsession…
Chinese hornets invading France, French productivity…
Any opportunity to revisit French history and self aggrandize one self by using the sacrifice of other people will do.
Excuse me, but it wasn’t me who first bought up Denmark’s Jews.
So, what gives ?
And you should really stop this habit of your of making false accusations against me when you can’t argue with the facts. I never talked about French surrender. This is not the first time you have accused me of things I have never talked about here, do you have a problem ?
Excuse me, but it wasn’t me who first bought up Denmark’s Jews.
So, what gives ?And you should really stop this habit of your of making false accusations against me
My post #84 had absolutely nothing do to with you, troll.
Which would be pretty obvious to anyone with half a brain.
While discussion is encouraged within the limits of acceptable discourse, we will continue to closely monitor the behaviour of users, most notably those that engage in trolling activities.
Miquelon.org is a watchdog group dedicated to documenting Anti-French activity in news and entertainment. Miquelon.org’s activities are of a purely academic and charitable in nature.
This site is a private initiative and does not represent the official policies of any State or any political group from France or anywhere else.
Another example of what is deemed “trolling” in this site
Person A : At Dunkirk, the Brits run back to their little island
Person B : French folded quickly during WW2
outrage follows over “folded quickly” remark and it is banned and the person who made that remark is labeled a troll and banned as well for good measure
Person C : How come “brits running back to their Island” is not bashing but French folding quickly is bashing “? Isn’t that a double standard and Brit bashing.
Outrage follows : Person C is a troll who yells double standards and brit bashing as a trolling mechanism . They are all lies etc etc.
(But no one addresses the issue that was raised by Person C, how come Brits running back to their island is not bashing? And no one will ever address that issue, much easier to label person C a troll to censor someone who points out double standards)
Learn to take a joke. It’s called a stereotype folks. Stereotypes aren’t necessarily true, and usually they’re exaggerations. White people will always be known for not being able to dance, black men for having large [Comment rule 4], Asians for not being able to drive, blondes for being dumb, and Germans for being Nazis. When used as an insult, yes, it’s not cool, but come on. A joke is a joke. If you’re French and someone makes a surrender joke it’s not a reflection on you, your friends, ancestors, or whatever. It’s based on a stereotype that was generated by one or more instances of it happening, but not absolute fact.
Brook, thanks for dropping by. The issue of what is or is not an acceptable joke has been debated on this site time and time again. All the stereotypes you mention are indeed common, but it does not make them right. By accepting them as merely jokes, you are perpetuating these stereotypes while you – and we – should all strive to do better and know better.
A joke is not just a joke. Because of social norms and pressures, certain jokes are not longer acceptable today. We – the French – do not have large lobbies to remind people of the offensive nature of some of those anti-French jokes people repeat with impunity. Our job is to redress this.
Let me also remind you that you joke about anything, just not with anyone. [quote from Pierre Desproges]
On a similar topic: How to Respond to a Racist Joke
If you’re a follower, you’ll laugh along at all racist / xenophobic jokes.
If you’re a leader, you’ll know how to show appropriate dissaproval.
Went to a small dinner gathering. Interesting collection of people, India, Jordan, Palestine, Peru, Brazil, Iran and five native born Americans. The core subject was the US healthcare system (yes, I’m one of those insurance types – Stoploss underwriting) and the group was a equal mix conservative to moderate to liberal. Conversation evolved to the French healthcare system. All were very positive about what the French provided. Most expressed they expected nothing but the best out of the French. Good vibes. We also expressed concern over the use over here of the Brits and Canada as bad examples -general frustration about all the negative talk that they hear. It is so nice to be in a room with people of different political positions and have a civilized, intelligent conversation.
^^^^
Well the discussions are always more civil and reasonable when people are face to face in a relaxed atmosphere.
Especially when food is involved.
Internet anonymity and the distance on the other hand is the perfect combination for people to act like total douches.
Person A: having a pizza and writing B.S on blogs/forums
Person B: presume you were referring to yourself …
Person A : person B is making personal attacks blah blah…
Now who first insinuated that posters here were eating pizza and writing B.S in blogs? Who first made that “attack” ?
@thibault
After so many attacks aimed at me in this site, just look at #100 following your post, you can understand why I took your comments as aimed at me. I didn’t realize you were talking generally.
Matters to chew on:
The fact of the matter is that Britain did “bug out” at Dunkirk. For example, Churchill had instructed British forces at Singapore to “fight to the last man”, being the British enjoyed a 3:1 military advantage in strength over Japanese invading forces. The Japanese infantryman was tough –much tougher than his British counterpart and so the British were defeated, driven all the way down the Malayan Peninsula to their island fortress, Singapore — Gen. Percival presenting the white flag to the Japanese Commander, Gen. Tomoyuki Yamashita, so-called Tiger of Malaya ( the Japanese had no air support during this campaign, their infantry advancing south –on bicycles, during battle lulls. The British BrewsterBuffalo, a single-engine fighter, had been employed in the British defense to no avail (it was soon learned during the War in the Pacific that Japanese forces could hardly be beaten when opposing forces were equal in men and material).
The British Expeditionary Forces in France, realizing they could not meet the test in alliance with their French ally against the Germans did, in a sense, “bug out” at Dunkirk (it was a hurried, desparate deparature in any man’s language, largely enabled by French covering forces). In retreat on their island haven, they –Churchill and his Cabinet– fully expected that America, under Pres. Roosevelt (anglophilic to the core), would save British interests and so it was to happen. The crux of the issue is that the British –by pure circumstance– had no need of surrender; indeed, they might go back to their little island and continue with the British Empire intact! Had Hitler not spoken of this in his Mein Kampf ? Had Hitler not pulled his generals back at Dunkirk –in effect giving the British time to re-access matters after having had their butt kicked ? As we all know, these British “cousins of the ‘German’ Saxons” might well rest assured; for, our Uncle Sam and truly their Uncle Samwould come the rescue.
Touching on the German Blitzkreigof WW II: Truly, an awesome attack operation by combined armor, infantry, air support — an “endless” onslaught, men/material of seemingly inexhaustable supply, effecting the outcome to be (what else ?). The operation has been referred to as “rolling artillery” and evolved as a battle approach following WW I. Keep in mind: No nation could have resisted the blitzkreig, presenting on Germany’s west border, WW II. Consider: Had either the U.S., the Russian or the British nation been located adjacent to that border, chaos would surely have ensued with a rapid fold-up (I would have given Washington, D.C., perhaps a week or ten days with our then standing Army; London would have fallen in three days; the Soviet Regime, being more diffuse, would require more time –perhaps several months; however, the fall of that state would happen [I state this with the German Army being fully engaged — having no other concern and the Russians standing alone]).
NOTE : The British General Staff during WW I remained under strict orders to restrict battle losses; or, ” let the French do the dying” –Barbara Tuchman, The Guns of August. The sequel to this admonition resulted with the British effecting few, if any, wilful closures with the German enemy; i.e., a deliberate straying on the battlefield that avoided combat ( a serious matter of honor for the British; for, a confrontation was to occur later between French and British Commanders in the field).
Fred (the other Fred), While I recognize your insight and appreciate your points, I, gracefully, remind you that this is a blog for addressing French bashing. I strongly recommend that it is not in our interests , no matter how suttle, to bash Allies. This does not mean that we can’t critize individual comments or decisions, just be aware that the UK was an Ally in WWII and they very much are today. Just my opinion.
Thanks Fred for that analysis. I presume that when the Brits went back to their little island as you put it, Hitler left that little Island alone and Brits went back to having a cup of tea & crumpets till the Normandy invasion.
Who knew that the London blitz was invented by British propaganda, not to mention the Battle of Britain which no doubt was collaborative effort by Hollywood and the British propaganda machine. Now if only we could find the director who made Coventry look like it was bombed to hell.
I’m with Fred Orth, enough dissecting of history for political argument. While the subject is fascinating and quite thrilling to learn about, one cannot extrapolate to today’s issue of French bashing, save explain the roots of some of the prejudice that exists on both sides.
Anybody can take a historical fact out of context, or turn it into a symbol – for I have done it – as a communication exercise – as well as John J. Miller, Mark Molesky or any user of any forum that has dealt with Franco-American politics.
Let’s never forget:
None of us are collectively and perpetually guilty for the actions of some
None of us can collectively and perpetually take credit for the actions of others (the point Doug Stanhope is making here)
Thank you
Just out of curiosity, how do you know collective guilt doesn’t exist. As far as I know the Germans after WW2 officially accepted collective guilt for atrocities committed in the name of Germany during WW2.
There are situations where, at least the intelligent portion of the population, will accept a “collective ” guilt. A lot of Germans for the brutality towards Jews and Gipseys, French for the 1940 collapse, Americans for the treatment of Blacks, Native Americans, etc., British for the mistakes with colonialism. Mistakes are made, it’s one of the things that happens in a democracy. We’re all still Allies. Love them all.
Fred, I agee somewhat but I must say I don’t think “mistakes” is the right word to use for genocide of Indians and slavery no matter who committed them, whether it was by european colonialists (Spanish, British, French, Portuguese) or later USA, Canada & Latin America. Also wanted to note that the genocide of Indians and slavery occurred throughout the ‘new world’, not merely within American borders.
As far as I know asking countries to take responsiblity for their actions is not assigning individual blame or guilt. I doubt that when the French parliament passed a resolution about the Armenian genocide they were saying individual Turks are guilty and therefore each individual Turk is guilty and should carry the weight of that burden.
Sharon, Good point, I couldn’t agree with you more. Hopefully, the Allies will never do it again. Getting the rest of the World on board, we may be facing an uphill struggle.
[The fact of the matter is that Britain did “bug out” at Dunkirk. For example, Churchill had instructed British forces at Singapore to “fight to the last man”, being the British enjoyed a 3:1 military advantage in strength over Japanese invading forces. The Japanese infantryman was tough –much tougher than his British counterpart and so the British were defeated, driven all the way down the Malayan Peninsula to their island fortress, Singapore – Gen. Percival presenting the white flag to the Japanese Commander, Gen. Tomoyuki Yamashita, so-called Tiger of Malaya……]
Thank you Fred for all those facts. Food for thought for the lecturers and otherwise armchair generals who find their way to miquelon.org (by accident of course) from time to time. Since it wasn’t a French surrender, I wonder how many of our British/American friends are aware of this little factoid.
Reminding some people who desperately want us to admit our inferiority , and use double standards and doubtful histrionics to that end, of some conveniently widely swept under the rug historical truths is not bashing IMO.
If reminding us of our folding fast in WWII is not bashing then reminding the “reminder” of some other historical fact as a reply is not bashing either.
Trolls obviously lack intellectual coherence.
Some people will never learn. Freedom liquor, baby.
[[Source: BBC
Calls for a boycott of Scottish goods have been made in the US following the controversial decision to release the man convicted of carrying out the Lockerbie bombing.
A website urging Americans to “Boycott Scotland” has been set up featuring a list of e-mail addresses for prominent Scottish and UK politicians, as well as contact details for Scottish newspapers and a list of Scottish products and companies. The site accuses the Scottish and UK governments of committing a “flagrant betrayal” by releasing Abdelbaset Ali al-Megrahi.
Grassroots campaigns were also taking hold on social networking sites such as Twitter and Facebook, while calls have even been made to have Scotch whisky renamed as Freedom Liquor.
Tourist body VisitScotland said it had received e-mails from Americans pledging to cancel holidays in Scotland.
Prehaps if these “facts” had been proved with credible sources than one might consider them facts but till then…….
I’m sorry, trollie. I forgot you were the utmost authority on what constitute facts and what doesn’t.
It is quite amusing that anything negative about France is automatically believed as “facts” even though no proof is provided.
There I fixed it for you, trollie.
Hey, trollie you’ve been trolling here for a while now.
Have you browsed other sections of miquelon.org such as French Bashing ?
You might learn a few things and stop clutching at straws.
I was reading about anti-Polish sentiment in the United States and I noticed some similarities with anti-French sentiment in the same country.
Notice how Fox had to apologize and vowed to never air that line ever again.
There’s been many (and I mean a lot, a lot) of jokes and references to the French being cowards and nazi collaborators on American TV and radio (miquelon’s site is well documented in that regard) and yet not once had any Network executive apologized and vowed to never air the incriminating lines ever again. Au contraire.
See that’s the difference between other ethnic groups and the French. We don’t have associations or lobbies to defend us and put a stop to that anti-French bigotry.
[[On November 14, 2007, FOX aired the episode of Back to You, “Something’s Up There“, which contained a controversial Polish slur. The slur involved Marsh trying to convince the show’s lone Polish-American character, Gary, to go bowling after work by saying: “Come on, it’s in your blood, like kielbasa and collaborating with the Nazis.” FOX later apologized on November 20, 2007. They vowed never to air the line of dialogue again in repeats and/or syndicated broadcasts. FOX stated that, “The line was delivered by a character known for being ignorant, clueless, and for saying outlandish things. Allowing the line to remain in the show, however, demonstrated poor judgment, and we apologize to anyone who was offended.”[51]]]
Out of 300 million people in the USA, how many are taking part in the boycott Scottish theme? Thousands ? hundreds? That would still make it 0.000001% of the population of USA.
Those who are writing so enthusiastically of an anti-Scottish sentiment running rampant in the USA are indulging in wishful thinking.
More facts to chew on:
The London Blitz is “small change” when viewed across the totality of destruction wreaked upon singular European nations during WW II. Most of us are aware of Dresden; or, payback time for London, Coventry, etc; however, for many Germans the firestorms that consumed Dresden are not to be forgotten nor forgiven.
Regarding the Battle of Britain: Primarily an “air show” with the British coming out ahead; i.e., being home-based and requiring only a landing for refueling to carry on with the show as needed. Weather patterns were to eventually call the act on the Germans and that is factual history. Regarding propaganda. Harry Truman at one time made a remark
on the subject, saying: The U.S. Marine Corps had a greater propaganda machine than did Stalin ! Now, if trollie Sharon suspects that Hollywood was called upon to effect favorable reviews of then British
war efforts, who can disagree ? To my mind the most noxious offender in this respect is the Fox Network with broadcast journalist, Bill O’Reilly, being lead-bitch of the dogpack.
Regarding The Tiger of Malaya, Gen. Tomoyuki Yamashita:
This Japanese commander was executed (hanged) by Allied forces shortly after WW II. He had been held responsible for war crimes taking place under his over-all command –said crimes occuring against Phillipino civilians during the Japanese “last stand” inside Manila.
Jurists of repute would argue that local commanders held responsibility
for what had occured; but, these men were all dead and someone had to answer. Keep in mind that Yamashita had won a great victory at Singapore over the British –said victory, it being proclamed by the defence at Allied war trial proceedings, ruling as the causative factor in his conviction.
[[Out of 300 million people in the USA, how many are taking part in the boycott Scottish theme? Thousands ? hundreds? That would still make it 0.000001% of the population of USA.Those who are writing so enthusiastically of an anti-Scottish sentiment running rampant in the USA are indulging in wishful thinking. ]]
Of course we are aware of the absurdity of this boycott and that it’s a fringe movement by loons and extremists. That’s not the point, trollie. You can’t even understand that ?
This blog used to be an oasis where we could discuss and document French-bashing without having to argue trolls like you. Which we otherwise have to face pretty much anywhere else on the net.
This is an anti French-bashing blog after all and since you don’t give a crap about French-bashing and since apparently from now on every post we make about French-bashing or related to French-bashing will be accompanied if not buried by your nonsensical bullcrap then this blog is in danger of losing a lot of its interest (IMHO).
I’m not sure what miquelon is trying to achieve by keeping someone like you around but I sincerely wish he’d reconsider. In the interest of this blog of which a lot of people care about deeply.
Or you could do a) the mature thing, pack your things and leave of your own accord or god forbid b) actually start contributing something constructive to the blog.
There’s no shame in going with a) since your trolling has been quite successful.
And thank you Fred once again for a very informative post.
Sharon, I think that you are right, the boycott is limited, but, no thanks to the outrage expressed on CNN, MSNBC, Fox, NBC, etc. PBS and NPR were, pretty much, neutral.
Don’t like Scotland bashing either. I do get irritated with the leadership of a certain Nation in North Africa, though.
“C’est un véritable rebondissement ! La Libye ne serait sans doute pas impliquée dans l’attentat contre le Boeing 747 qui a explosé en 1988 au-dessus de l’Ecosse, à Lockerbie exactement… Ce que disait déjà Monsieur X en 1998. Aussi, je vous propose de réécouter intégralement cet enregistrement. Mais d’abord, j’ai demandé à mon interlocuteur pourquoi l’agent secret libyen, qui était considéré jusqu’à aujourd’hui comme le principal instigateur de cet acte terroriste qui a provoqué la mort de 270 personnes, sera rejugé et peut-être innocenté…”
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