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Educating Jay Promo

09.01.2009 · Posted in Educating Jay

Educating Jay – EmotionFilmsLtd © 2009.

Disclaimer : This video contains copyrighted material the use of which has not always been specifically authorized by the copyright owner. We are making such material available in our efforts to advance understanding of environmental, political, human rights, economic, democracy, scientific, and social justice issues, etc. We believe this constitutes a ‘fair use’ of any such copyrighted material as provided for in section 107 of the US Copyright Law. In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, the material in this video is distributed without profit to those who have expressed a prior interest in receiving the included information for research and educational purposes.

More about Educating Jay

  • Jay Leno and the Tonight Show – Collected anti-French materials.
  • Adieu Jay – You called my people cowards on a nightly basis for years based on your skewed perception of events in World War II and your willingness to please the Bush administration before and during the Iraq war.
  • Re: James Douglas Muir Leno
  • Jay Leno’s French Obsession – Is Jay Leno afraid of the Consul General of France? First, let’s deal with his latest anti-French monologues. Before losing his writing team to the WGA strike, Jay Leno could not reign in his obsession with the surrender of June 22nd 1940.

92 Responses to “Educating Jay Promo”

  1. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    Wow, it looks great, Marc.
    I’ve been waiting for this for a while. When is it coming out ?

    You truly are a great Frenchman, sir.

  2. To Marc:
    This man, Jay, Should have gotten a fist in the face for his “jokes”  –it does work wonders in effecting a change in habits; moreover, any charges levied against the attacker would have mitigating circumstance.  It is because the French remain passive to bashing that offences occur, time and time again !

  3. Irish-Franco-American says:

    Bravo Marc!  I can’t wait to see the video (I can’t now because I’m at work).  I would like to give Jay Leno a bloody nose and two black eyes.

  4. I don’t know that concentrating on Jay is totally correct. I like what Marc did, but, most of what comics say are written for them. Were the thoughts his or did he simply go, as is likely, with a writer’s idea that would appeal to the mob. As few comics as I know, I do hear that most of them go more often with their writers’ hunches rather than their own, especially if the writer has a track record of getting laughs. Just saying.

  5. @ Marc. Congratulations for this nice video!
    It takes time and patience to achieve that sort of thing. I do hope this will be an eye opener for some people.

    @ Fred (Orth) : I ‘technically’ concur with you. However the main issue here is sad prejudiced jokes become character traits with the help of talented anchormen. They/their writers might know better, or their sole concern might be television audience, but what about the average viewer?
    For I can’t believe Jay would have used these jokes had he felt just a hint of guilt/doubt/fear about them. He decided to use the jokes, he took responsibility for it, no matter who wrote them in the first place. Does it mean the jokes were pretty commonplace in his opinion, now this would be real prejudice.
    Have a great day everyone!

  6. Jocoul, Of course you are correct. The problem is that a joke referencing Niger, India or any multitude of nations would not have acheived any laughs, just stares of confusion. It is prejudice that is the core of a lot of Jay’s jokes. It always stems for a lack of knowledge by the audience and the jokers take advantage of it. Insults directed at Canada and Mexico are the common thrust today. California gets insulted in the South, New York is insulted in the Midwest. Comedians depend upon their audience not thinking about the consequences of their jokes and, unfortunitely, they are often wrong – like in this case. What Marc is doing is ethical and correct, but if the “sound bits” warrent, a comedian will keep on going.

  7. Jocoul :  I do hope this will be an eye opener for some people.

    If you think this is an eye opener than you surely don’t know much about what goes on outside the USA despite your many discussions with non-Americans which are according to your own words "open discussion, freed from cliches, prejudices and taboos."

    In Europe jokes based on ethnic stereotypes are plenty and much worse, not to mention jokes based on stereotypes of Americans are plentiful.
    You should ask your German managers what they call Poles in Germany ……ever heard of any "car thieves" jokes from your German friends?  

    Prehaps those discussions with your many European friends are not so free of taboos and cliches as you think.

  8. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    Fred O. The problem isn’t jokes. Comedians can joke all they want about France, there’s plenty of material available.

    It’s just that those surrender jokes are particularly vile because of the hundreds of thousands of French deaths last century (military and civilian). 
    And furthermore they are a complete fabrication of history for anyone who has studied up a little bit on the true military history of France. Which neither starts nor ends in June 1940.

    When Jay Leno says that the French Resistance was a myth, is he still joking ? Frankly I don’t think he is. Which leads one to wonder if he truly believes the French are cowards. In which case his surrender “jokes” become something else entirely.

  9. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    #7

    Dammit. I thought we had gotten rid of that [tos3] troll.
    Go spew your nonsense somewhere please.

  10. Sharon – yes there’s plenty of American stereotyping in Europe as well, the big difference is that it is not targeted at wide audiences by mainstream media (FoxNews etc…) or for entertainment (Jay Leno etc…).

  11. Barney, I agree with you completely, but, other than Marc’s approach, I don’t know how you stop this until it, as always, runs out of steam and is no longer thought of, by some, as “funny”.

  12. Sharon, I was born and raised in Europe, I know what’s going on there and I already stated that there are things I’m obviously not proud of.
    Now you may like to read posts 8 and 10 again, they clearly explain what’s so specifically twisted with French bashing. The latter being the core topic of this blog, as Barney cared to remind you countless times.

  13. Jocoul,  Europe is a continent. I presume you were born and raised in a particular country in Europe.

    That said Europe is too big, complex with countless regional differences  so you may not be aware of the “specific twisted”  bashing of Gypsies, Turks, Arabs  that goes on in certain European countries which is far worse than any French bashing one would see on Jay.  

    So there is nothing specifiically twisted about French bashing….believe it or not there is much worse . So is there nothing “specifically twisted” about the  common ethnic slurs against Poles as “car thieves” in Germany given that millions of Poles died as a result of Germany aggression in WW2?  After all that the was the logic used in the French case.

  14. FrancisK: big difference is that it is not targeted at wide audiences by mainstream media

    You have to know SEVERAL European languages to make this judgement.  One has to know the native tongue to know what is commonly said in the mainstream media.

  15. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    ^^^^

    Voila

    The troll is gonna hijack another thread with its out of topic nonsensical crap.

    And you gotta love the not so subtle justification of French-bashing too, which by the way has always been the troll’s true purpose since it got here.

    What a waste of air that troll is.

  16. @Barney, can you tell us the racial slurs for Arabs in France……don’t you find that particular twisted given how hundreds of thousands of Arabs suffered and died during French imperial rule?

  17. sharon, the term Arab is incorrect and shows ignorance about the immigrants in France. Try learning the differences that exist between berbers, north-africans, algerians, moroccans, tunisians … “Arab” is as generic and offensive to some as “Eskimo”.
    While on the subject, there is no prime-time comedy show where anti-anything jokes are told day in day out. There are no news channels dedicating to vilifying a people, culture or country.

    How many French TV channels can you name? How many French media personalities can you name? How many French TV shows can you name? How many French newspapers do you read, how many French radios shows do you listen to?

  18. @Marc, no doubt you know more about French media than I but others who also pay attention to the French media have a very different view…….

    http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1574817,00.html

    …..French variant is altogether more toxic. The latest outrage came from second-string TV personality and self-appointed social commentator Pascal Sevran, whose recently published book included the obscenely racist idea that the “black [penis] is responsible for famine in Africa
    Sevran’s prurient opinions are but the latest addition to the growing racist chatter in the French mainstream

    A month earlier, a Socialist political kingpin in the Montpellier region sparked fury — and possible expulsion from the party — by lamenting that France’s national soccer team fielded “9 blacks out of 11” starting players. “I’m ashamed of this country,” in which “the whites are lousy,” he groused, and would soon be fielding teams “where all 11 players are black.” That echoed a comment a year earlier by philosopher Alain Finkelkraut, who — seeking to explain the 2005 rioting by youths descended from immigrants in France’s suburbs — made allusion to France’s “white-black-Arab” soccer side that won the 1998 World Cup and became an icon of French social integration. ” Today, [the team is] black-black-black, and it’s the laughingstock of Europe,” Finkelkraut complained.

    Even some black Frenchmen have joined the bigoted chorus: In November, the black comic known as Dieudonn頭ade a conspicuous appearance at the annual congress of Jean-Marie Le Pen’s National Front party — much to the pleasure of extreme-rightists looking to lose their racist stigma without changing their xenophobic positions. For the last two years, the self-described leftist Dieudonn頨ad outdone even Le Pen in Jew-baiting, delivering a series of brazenly anti-Semitic remarks, belittling the Holocaust and depicting Jews as racist persecutors of blacks and Arabs.

    The rising torrent of racist language and publicly expressed racist attitudes may be a sign less that racism is spreading, than that the boundaries of mainstream tolerance are changing.

     Clearly, the political “filter” in the U.S. public square that prompts a Michael Richards or a Mel Gibson to grovel apologetically following publicly recorded racial insults is considerably less developed in France

    France rejects affirmative action as incompatible with its republican ideals of color-blind equality for all citizens. Nice in theory, but that’s not working in practice: discrimination continues, inequality is rife, and notions of color-blindness don’t square with the rising chorus of racially loaded commentary. Color-blindness may also function to keep France blind to racial discrimination and inequality, but the rising tide of anger in the projects and racist chatter in the mainstream suggests that the French may soon have no choice but to openly confront what color-blindness prefers not to see.

    http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1574817,00.html

    ***********************************************************
    What was all that about no mainstream media in France & Europe  vilifying an entire culture, peoples ? ? ?

  19. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    @Barney, can you tell us the racial slurs for Arabs in France……don’t you find that particular twisted given how hundreds of thousands of Arabs suffered and died during French imperial rule?
     
    Sorry, troll.
    The subject of this thread is Marc’s upcoming documentary about educating Jay.
    If you wanna discuss ethic slurs for Arabs in France or racism in France I suggest you visit fuck*france.com or no pasaran.
     
    Ans sorry but Marc I won’t be participating to your blog anymore as long this anti-French troll is allowed to hijack every thread it wants with total impunity.
     
    I don’t come to miquelon.org to “argue” the French bashing apologists and otherwise haters I have to confront anywhere else.
    You got two choices with trolls. a) Ban them or b) ridicule every single of their fallacies with researched arguments. Any other choice is a victory for the troll who can get its message across.
    b) being a little too time consuming for my taste given the amount of crap trollie is spewing here.
     
     

  20. Exactly my point. Dieudonné is now banished from the media.
    Others have been excluded as well or seen their political lives shortened.
    Next.

  21. What was all that about no mainstream media in France & Europe  vilifying an entire culture, peoples ? ? ?

    Sharon, this article you provided is for the most part (painfully) accurate IMO, however it does not address what Marc wrote (there is no prime-time comedy show where anti-anything jokes are told day in day out. There are no news channels dedicating to vilifying a people, culture or country). Why?

    -The late Pascal Sevran was like a true institution to the elderly with his show “La chance aux chansons” but he was despised by many people  because of the stupid prejudiced remarks he sometimes included in his books (the “black penis” idiocy was part of one of his last publication, and it was noticed by an outraged journalist who spread the news). Pascal Sevran,  unlike Jay, did not utter these words during his show. His BS was not forced on everyone. Had it been the case, no doubt he would have been fired right away, regardless of his track record of huge television audience. The latter being the reason why he eventually was retained, despite of harsh discussions within his channel managing board (alas, money comes first).

    -Dieudonné used to be a renowned and much appreciated stand up comedian (especially during his early career with his counterpart Elie: Elie was the Jew, Dieudonné was the black guy, and the team would blow apart cliches in a deliciously non politically correct manner). A couple years back, Dieudonné turned into a spooky radical political leader, embracing both (if that is ever possible) extreme left and right paradigms, making bleak jokes on whatever controversial topic. Shocked reactions will make him high. BUT several court rulings forbade him to carry out shows because of this sickening attitude. He still is banned on a regular basis, and most shows that did take place were welcomed with hostile protests. He more or less bypassed these hindrances by creating his own stand up place in Paris where he can rant and provoke (he invited a (in)famous holocaust denier there). His counterargument for all this mess is freedom of speech.
    However one can notice that he does not access mainstream media, or when he does he’s a foil for the anchorman (television audience is first once again).

    -Alain Finkelkraut or other prejudiced public figures : indeed there is underlying racism in France, among both the elites and the ‘rank and file’,
    nobody here is arguing this. But mainstream media merely spread these sad comments (as is their mission), they don’t indulge in them or make these comments theirs, unlike J.

    The rising torrent of racist language and publicly expressed racist attitudes may be a sign less that racism is spreading, than that the boundaries of mainstream tolerance are changing.

    I would draw the same conclusion. Another brilliant reason for this blog to exist. We surely do not want to follow J’s example.

    Sharon, you are entitled to be argumentative but we’re well aware of most “European baggage” you come up with.  There are indeed other forms of prejudices on this planet, worse forms too as you stated it, and you or I could find countless examples. Thing is Marc decided to fight French bashing. Maybe you’re not interested.

  22. Barney, banning sharon would only prove her deepest held obsession about our lack of openess. While I understand your position, and trust me .. I DO … at the same time sharon is forcing us to craft our position more acurately.

    As well, watching her go down in flames in thread after thread only conforts me in the fact we are on the right track. So I will not ban sharon at this point as no TOS violation is evident save the constant trolling.

    It’s the gift that keeps on giving 🙂

  23. Jocoul – excellent rebuttal.

    Let’s get this back on track. Why Jay Leno you say?
    Well, first off, I am convinced Jay holds these beliefs. Sure his writers supply him with the material, but Jay is a true professional in the sense he does most of his work and never ever stops. For that he is admirable. The quality of his work however remains controversial and that’s where we enter.

    Not only does he believe this, he’s made some very offensive during a press interview – not a monologue – about the French resistance.

    “Well, there’s nothing funnier to me than the French. The French Resistance is probably the biggest mythical joke that ever existed. There were four guys in the French Resistance. They couldn’t hand over the Jewish people fast enough. Oh, please, don’t tell me about the French. The French have all sorts of secret deals with Saddam and everybody else for two cents a liter. It’s an easy target.” – James Douglas Muir Leno, Interview with Nikki Finke, LA Weekly.

    The other reason I focus on Leno is he is the GEN-POP actor of French Bashing. Howard Stern, Dennis Miller, Bill O’Reilly, Glenn Beck all have clout, all have huge audiences, but they are all politically inclined or marginal in reach beyond their core listeners. Leno on the other hand has a huge swath of influential listeners.

    Jay is the propagator of the surrender meme. With more than 40 jokes on the subject, he is responsible – beyond Goldberg, beyond the Simpsons – for the acceptance of this myth. Thus, our attempt to educate him.

    No dates yet on the release, I have a number of people working on this for very little pay …

  24. That which is most galling to Americans of French extraction re French bashing is the ignorance, disregard and open hostility being demonstrated against one of the three major players [ France, England, Spain ] in the founding of this country.  You can visit Yorktown and come away with an appreciation for France’s spilt blood; however, it would seem that less-distinguished-present-day-stock  (the least involved by country involved)  must of neccessity tear down that spilt-blood image lest their “short-coming” remain so self-evident.  The Irish, among others, would have it that they are the all-American boy, Jack Armstrong; but, we know they arrived on the scene at a time when everything had been “accomplished”.  So I would say get off of it, scion of Cheddar Man, and find satisfaction elsewhere.

  25. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    [[Barney, banning sharon would only prove her deepest held obsession about our lack of openess. While I understand your position, and trust me .. I DO … at the same time sharon is forcing us to craft our position more acurately.
    As well, watching her go down in flames in thread after thread only conforts me in the fact we are on the right track. So I will not ban sharon at this point as no TOS violation is evident save the constant trolling.
    It’s the gift that keeps on giving :-)]]
    Yeah, you’re right.
    I may have overreacted.

  26. [I may have overreacted.]

    No, you gave me an opening to state my case 😉

  27. Barney : If you wanna discuss ethic slurs for Arabs in France or racism in France I suggest you visit fuck*france.com or no pasaran.

    I had no idea you were living in a dictatorship, so sorry for thinking that France was an open democratic society where its ills are discussed in the open like every other democratic country.

    I can now understand why you are obsessed with censorship by hurling your  favorite words  Troll and especially Ban, poor thing you are unused to open discussions.

  28. So the Irish are now bashed for not being so petty and small minded unlike certain other people who can’t let go of what happened centuries ago. LOL

  29. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    [[I had no idea you were living in a dictatorship, so sorry for thinking that France was an open democratic society where its ills are discussed in the open like every other democratic country.I can now understand why you are obsessed with censorship by hurling your  favorite words  Troll and especially Ban, poor thing you are unused to open discussions. ]]

    Do you have something to say about Marc’s upcoming documentary about educating Jay Leno or not, you [tos3] troll ?

  30. André Wernesson says:

    Sharon, if your tone were not so wantonly provocative and blatantly trollish you’d be most welcome. Obviously, you are merely debasing the concept of free speech — as most trolls do — by not understanding the basic rules of free speech, which apply in all democratic countries. “Free speech” isn’t a valid excuse to insult, harass or slander. So, sorry, stop hurling the words “censorship” and “dictatorship” around, or you’ll only make a greater fool out of yourself.

    In this case you are clearly intentionally disrupting the flow of debate, provoking through slanderous and malicious posts, and generally engaging in a behaviour known as trolling on the internet.

    Mark, my vote goes to apply the full weight of the ToS’ clauses against trolls upon this superb specimen of trollery.

  31. The same old story…hurl false accusations one after another. Another person who cannot bear to see unflattering facts presented. Some people definitely crave to censor people by hurling false accusations..must have something to do with the fascist mentality  one can find in some Europeans. It is so obvious that the fascist mentality that produced fascism in Europe did not die out after WW2. And please note that just beacause one’s grandparents fled from fascist attacks does not mean the fascist mentality was absent from the country they fled to …and no doubt were influenced by it without realizing it.

  32. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    #31
    Troll. Do you have something to say about Marc’s upcoming documentary “Educating Jay” or not ?

  33. @Jocoul :  there is no prime-time comedy show where anti-anything jokes are told day in day out. There are no news channels dedicating to vilifying a people, culture or country

    You are of course referring to the USA. Being a consumer of US media daily, I  don’t see any comedy show with day in day out attacks on the French. Neither do I see any news channels "dedicated" to French bashing. Oh yeah Fox news you may say…but that.is not a channel dedicated to French bashing…I hardly hear anything about the French in Fox news except once in a while . The vast majority of its news hours are devoted to non-French issues. It is accurate to say Fox news is dedicated to Obama bashing as most of its hours are devoted to Obama. Period .

    Why the need to exaggerate by using words like "day in day out" and "dedicated".

    If you spoke more accurately and gave up the gross exaggerations, than you might be surprised by how many people might agree with you but with the need to exaggerate and paint some exclusivity about French bashing as "specifically twisted" which is nonsense, you are  losing any valid points you might have.

  34. @ Miquelon :  Dieudonné is now banished from the media.

    Oh just like Jay who longer hosts the show anymore?
     

  35. Marc, Got my audio back (it comes and goes, whenever), I REALLY liked your video!  If you came down US66, though, you should have hollered, I’d have bought you a meal. This blog has reminded me of the bashing that Jay “provided” for so many years, though, after his first one, I stopped watching him. Missed the worst. Hats off to you for providing a select driven focus on a select issue. Great Job.

  36. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    Guess not….

    you are  losing any valid points you might have.

    Hilarious coming from trollie.

  37. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    Leno will be coming back soon in prime time. His show will get even more viewers now.

    Let’s hope he has learned a thing or two.

  38. Barney, has it ever occurred to you that your bile and venom may  contribute towards French bashing in the Net at least ( unintentionally )by living up to all the crude stereotypes perpeutated by Jay.

    People like you are the "gift that keeps giving" for Jay to keep on peddling his jokes.

  39. André Wernesson says:

    OK Sharon, here’s your previous post, condensed:

    Bla bla bla censor bla bla bla fascist bla bla bla fascism bla bla bla fascist fascist bla bla bla.

    As any impartial observer may notice, your post is rich in fail. I comment on your trollesque behaviour, you respond by calling me a “fascist”, and by making a ridiculous extrapolation about alleged “fascist mentalities” in Europe. I summon Godwin’s law: he who calleth his opponent a nazi in a web debate, loseth the debate.

    And now, people, please cooperate: Don’t feed the troll.

  40. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    #38
    Dear troll,
    Miquelon.org is a website dedicated to documenting and denouncing French-bashing.
    Do you get that ?

    So the Germans hate the Poles. Let the  Poles create their own website to fight Polish-bashing then.
    This blog is about French-bashing.

    If you can’t stand that, get some help but stop wasting our time.

    And why the hell would I be nice to people who come here solely to bring up negative facts about France and who try their damnedest to justify French-bashing ?

    Obviously, the people who are into that sort of thing already have their own issues with the French. 

    Oh wait let me guess. You’re actually a great francophile, right ? lol

    I hope you realize you’re not fooling anyone, troll.
    And if that makes you hate the French evn more. Good. If people like you hate us, then we’re doing something right.

    ps:
    Now Troll, do you have something to say about Marc’s upcoming documentary “Educating Jay”, the topic of this thread, or not ?

  41. Andre what exactly is troll behaviour….pointing out inaccuracies, exaggerations etc.   I rest my case about the fascist mentality.

  42. To Sharon @ Post # 28:
    You are not turning things around as you might imagine in extolling–by default–  a supposed forgive and forget excellence to be found in the Irish.  You have mentioned your Irish-ness; therefore, you should be  showing no “covert” malice  –especially against the French,  in your French bashing.  Why not go against the English, a nation that has bloodied you people a million times over.  As I said earlier, you have taken on the role of [term removed]*  with the Anglosphere being your patron; or, the all American girl  —anything to escape the Irish-ness
    (what, after all, have the Irish ever done on the world stage in history ?). 
     In your post #28 is seen definite game-playing  —  so tricky, your word play —  being all the same the work of a dumb broad that would hold in delusion a notion that others cannot see thru you. Can you not broach something on your own that is an original thought or concept ?  My God, lady, get a life.

  43. @Freddy the Brit basher :

    I think you are projecting your mentality onto me.
    I don’t see myself as Irish, I see myself as a citizen of the country of my birth where I was raised.  You on the other hand seem to identify with your ancestory more than the country you are a citizen of.  You are entitled to do so but don’t project that mentality onto others.  So your insults about the Irish have no impact on me.  It would,  if  like you I identified with my ancestory more than my country of citizenship but I don’t….so sorry !

    By the way thanks for introducing me to words like “court jew” etc,  I had never heard words like that before.  And again this shows the difference between your neck of the woods and mine… .. need we say more about why I don’t hold any grievances for what happened centuries ago which no doubt drives British bashers like you to the loony bin.

    By they way, I noticed that the Irish, Jews and Brits have all been targets of your nasty insults ….while you  howl and scream about French bashing. Does the word hypocrite ring a bell?

  44. “One has to know the native tongue to know what is commonly said in the mainstream media.”
    I was born and raised in France and I’ve lived in the US for over 20 years. I think that makes me sufficiently knowledgeable in telling the difference. Mind you, I have told many individual Frenchmen before not to generalize their views of Americans but never have I seen such a degree of odious clichés and insults about “the French” than on the US mainstream media and I thank Miquelon for exposing that. There is simply no equivalent in France that I know of to the Jay Lenos, Bill O’Reillys and company. And speaking of the UK, notice the pass they’re getting in regards of the Megrahi release scandal. Just imagine if Sarkozy had been behind the affair, it would be sheer hysteria again.

  45. André Wernesson says:

    @41

    Sharon asketh:

    Andre what exactly is troll behaviour….pointing out inaccuracies, exaggerations etc.   I rest my case about the fascist mentality.

    André replieth:

    In this case, young failhopper, you may find Teh Wiki to be of great help. To quote Teh Wiki, a troll is
    someone who posts controversial, inflammatory, irrelevant or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room or blog, with the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional or disciplinary response[1] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.[2]
    Sounds just like yourself if you ask me.

    Oh, as for the renewed fascist reference, you’ve just enabled me to summon Godwin’s Law once again.

    You really need to brush up on your debating skills.

  46. @Sharon#33
    Nice chitchat, next time try to quote things I wrote though.

  47. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    Congratulations, trollie.
    You have managed yet again to hijack another thread with your whining about…what is is this time ?  I can’t even tell. It doesn’t matter.

    What matters is that nobody’s talking about Marc’s trailer anymore. You have succeeded. You’re a great troll indeed.

    Let me take this opportunity to ask you again:
    do you have anything to say about Marc’s upcoming documentary 3educating Jay”, which is the topic of this thread ?

  48. @Jocoul
     Likewise but I hope you develope some critical thinking skill so that you don’t fall blindly for gross exaggerations & hyperbole so easily.

  49. I hope so too. Now what is it you wanted to say about Marc’s video?

  50. Jay who?

    We are not living in the world of the big three networks anymore. Believe it or not there are millions and millions of people who never watched Jay. Johnny Carson dominated the prime time airwaves but Jay?  One of many who had very limited influence.  Much ado about nothing.

  51. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    Much ado about nothing.

    Does trollie realize the  irony of that statement coming from trollie ?
    It’ s surreal. lol

    And if you don’t care about Jay Leno’s French-bashing  (as you don’t care about French-bashing in general), then you have nothing to do on this thread and on this blog.

    By the way, how’d you wind up on miquelon.org, trollie ?

  52. To Sharon(i) @ Post # 43:
    You remain ethnic Irish regardless of birth location and are perceived as such in the “bread lines” of the past; moreover, extending to this day in
    the hustle for government hand-outs of whatever value.  Blood Tells, it has been said, being a truism; also, a leopard cannot change it’s spots,
    leaving you to pause in consideration of the facts at hand.  “What shall I be”, you ask yourself, knowing that your posterity offers little in the way of  truly civilized behavior.  “Oh, I get it, being born in Canada qualifies  me to be a subject”, you reflect.  “Happy, happy, happy-land, I am no longer Irish”, you sing with uncommon joy   –alas, forgetting that your born-again, “Janet Reno” looks can never turn about and that is sad enough.

  53. @Freddy the [tos3]
    Your bizarre obsession with ethnicity reminds me of  the mindset of a very famous person who too was equally obsessed with ethnicity and ranted &  raved his idiotic views on the importance of ethnicity. We need not mention his name. [Godwin point]

  54. Who the hell is Godwin…… God ?    LOL

  55. André Wernesson says:

    #53 Who the hell is Godwin…… God ? LOL

    Nope, someone who tried to prevent terrible debaters like yourself from ruining discussions. You may think you’re smart, but comparing people to nazis is about the cheapest, dumbest thing you can do. This hardly surprises me — as a troll, you surrender at one moment, resurface at another, jump, dodge, ignore points, carry on regardless.

    Your points and relevance have been decimated, and you’ve never had a logical answer to offer; and still you insist on attempting to disrupt conversation. You are incapable of any logical construction more complicated than “LOL NO” or “You are a nazi” and yet you insist on taking an intellectual beating from all of us.

    Give me a break.

  56. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    lol good rebuttal, André.

    I’d like trollie to answer the following:

    How did you stumble into miquelon.org ?

    I mean you obviously couldn’t care less about French-bashing so I don’t think you ended up here after googling “French-bashing”.

    It’s more likely you ended up here after following a link on some blog you participate to.
    Given your obsession with American/British bashing from the French I would like to say no pas*r*n but you don’t strike me as a no pas*r*n troll for some reason.
    So I will stick with my first guess and say you ended up here following a link on Br*mner’s blog. Because I hardly think your appearing here on this blog only hours after r*cket and after I mentioned Br*mner’s blog is a coincidence.

    So which is it, troll ?
    Be honest for once in your life.

  57. @Andre,
    Intolerance of different views is a sign of a fascist mentality. If the shoe fits, accept it.

     If you see different views as an attempt to quote “disrupt conversation”  need we say more about your deep intolerance for different viewpoints.

    All you are reduced to doing now is howling and screaming insults at me because you can’t deal with different views and opinions.

    Trying to invoke Godwin in order to give a moral boost to your intolerance of different views is rather insulting to Godwin wouldn’t you say?
     
     

  58. @Barney
    It may come as a shock to you that just as millions of people don’t watch Jay,  millions of people don’t know all those blogs you are obsessed with. Deal with it.

    Unless of course you are so arrogant you think everybody in the world is obsessed with the same things you are obsessed with because you are so important.
     
     
     

  59. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    Different views and opinions ?
    Well sure, troll, if you put it that way. lol

    Showing up out of the blue to spew nonsense about French imperialism (or anything negative you can find about France) on a thread dedicated to Marc’s upcoming documentary is not not having different views. It’s purposefully playing the troll and you know it.

    You’re being insulted because you have made it abundantly clear that you don’t care a lick about French-bashing
    and you bellitle the importance of French-bashing at every opportunity when you’re not trying to justify it.

    That would be fine on fu*kfrance.com or Bemner’s blog. The only problem is that miquelon.org is a blog about denouncing the ills of French-bashing.


    [[Trying to invoke Godwin in order to give a moral boost to your intolerance of different views is rather insulting to Godwin wouldn’t you say?
    ]]

    Errr, you’re the one who does exactly that trollie.
    My God, nobody can’t be that clueless, can they ?

    ps:  How’d you wind up on miquelon.org, troll ?

  60. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    [[@Barney
    It may come as a shock to you that just as millions of people don’t watch Jay,  millions of people don’t know all those blogs you are obsessed with. Deal with it.]]

    Answer the question, troll.
    How’d you wind up on miquelon.org ?

  61. @barney : to spew nonsense about French imperialism 

    France’s former colonies may beg to differ with you that French imperalism is “nonsense”.

    PS: When you tell a lie, tell a good one so that you don’t get caught. This is embarrassing to say the least. Whats next? Oh yeah French never had any colonies?

  62. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    [[France’s former colonies may beg to differ with you that French imperalism is “nonsense”.
    PS: When you tell a lie, tell a good one so that you don’t get caught. This is embarrassing to say the least. Whats next? Oh yeah French never had any colonies?]]
     
    Perfect example of the troll‘s mindset. To purposefully misinterpret and twist your words so the troll can keep on ramming its agenda down out throats.
     
    Now the troll is probably gonna go on for 2 or 3 pages about how we support French imperialism. lol
     
     
    ps: How did you wind up on miquelon.org ?
    Answer the question, troll.

  63. André Wernesson says:

    Intolerance of different views is a sign of a fascist mentality. If the shoe fits, accept it.

    1 – I am not intolerant of “different views”, I am intolerant of people who are clearly here with the sole purpose of bothering others.

    2 – Your use of “fascist mentality” is incorrect, anyhow, as intolerance isn’t, and has never been, exclusive to fascism.

     If you see different views as an attempt to quote “disrupt conversation”  need we say more about your deep intolerance for different viewpoints.
    I didn’t know trolling was a “viewpoint”. To my view it’s more like being a jerk.

    All you are reduced to doing now is howling and screaming insults at me because you can’t deal with different views and opinions.
    Howling and screaming? Sheesh, this font must be pretty loud. I repeat: you have no “views and opinions”. You are a troll. Your “views and opinions” are merely to bother others.

    Trying to invoke Godwin in order to give a moral boost to your intolerance of different views is rather insulting to Godwin wouldn’t you say?

    So after you build a massive strawman, here comes the conclusion. Congratulations — you can use logic, but only logical fallacies, alas.
    I invoked Godwin’s law because you’re breaking it systematically. It’s a typical troll’s resource to call others nazis and intolerant when they point out that he’s being a troll.

    Trust me, troll. I’ve seen more than my fair share of trolls on the interwebz, and I know all your stupid tricks. In fact, I can even predict your responses. It will be something along the lines of:

    Intolerant intolerant bla bla bla, different viewpoint bla bla, fascist mentality bla bla, censor bla fascist bla intolerant bla bla bla.

  64. Ok, so you see different viewpoints as  “trolling”.
    Thanks for proving my point – if the shoe fits accept it.

  65. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    Ok, so you see different viewpoints as  “trolling”.
     
    No. We see trolling as trolling.
    You don’t even have a coherent viewpoint.

  66. As we all know this is what passes for trolling in this site.

    Person A : Denmark only had 6000 Jews whereas France had 300, 000 Jews

    Person B:  The total population of Denmark is 4 million.

    Person A:  What a sick troll. Don’t feed the troll.

    Another example

    Person A :  There is no bashing of an entire peoples in the French mainstream.  ( applauded by other posters and quoted again and again)

    Person B:   According to other sources, racist chatter in the French maintream exists,  vilifying an entire people’s & culture – link to time article given which writes about growing racist chatter in the French mainstream

    Outrage from other posters  and chorus of ” person B is a sick troll, is trolling by bashing France (in other words  don’t dare tell unpleasant facts about racism in France’ mainstream media  to address the incorrect assertion made by Person A that there no vilfying of an entire people in the French mainstream – that is trolling)

    Another example:

    Person A:  In the USA, comedy channels day in day out bash the french and there is a major news network dedicated to French bashing.

    Person B:  there is no comedy channel with day in day out bashing of the French. And when over 99% of Fox news is devoted to non-French issues how can it be a channel dedicated to French bashing?  Gross exaggerations.

    Chorus of person B is trolling follows.

    Naturally they have to invoke Godwin to cover up their intolerance for the truth when the truth is not to their liking.

  67. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    Here we go again. lol

  68. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    [[@oxofamilydadSays:
    September 6th, 2009 at 11:05 am

    you are a [tos 2 & tos 3] that picks out 1 tweet to satisfy your [tos 2 & tos 3] life that is obviously spent defending your country’s supposed honour,get a [tos 2 & tos 3] life….if you bothered to read more than 1 tweet of mine you would realise that I stated instantly that it was a joke and i love France and many french people that i know ……you ,[tos 2 & tos 3] ,categorically don’t come in that group ……grow up and get a [tos 2 & tos 3] proper life….i also mock the welsh ,scottish english and some ….but they can take a joke …now [tos 2 & tos 3]]]
    [[@oxofamilydad Says:
    September 6th, 2009 at 8:01 pm

    the sheer fact that Andre Wernesson had to put “sarcasm” at the end of his comment about me being a French basher ,goes to show that he isn’t confident in someone realising it was meant as sarcasm…I however have the intelligence to realise that even a very poor and unamusing little comment like that is sarcasm …I also have a sense of humour so find something very funny him calling me  a basher,as in english coloquialism,that is a person that [tos 2 & tos 3] .So he is saying that i [tos 2 & tos 3] the french ,well it is obvious they need no help with that if he is anything to go by.And as for me not being polite ,well,the irony .]]

    @oxo, would you be interested to see the sarcastic list of the names of the 1.3 French soldiers who died in WWI ?
    I got hundreds of sarcastic pictures of monuments to the dead in France as well if you’re interested.

    How about a sarcastic picture of the the twin towers on fire ? How many Americans does it take to defend a skyscraper ? Don’t know. Never been tried.

    You have kids huh ? Are they little xenophobes like their dad ?

    [[i tied a rocket to my neighbours cat’s tail today and lit it ,neighbour was devestated but the cat was over the moon…….]]

    Yeah, the cutting edge of comedy all right…

  69. Sharon, it has become absolutely obvious you don’t listen to anything you are told, you twist and turn anything that is said and you are simply rehashing the same-old same-old with complete disregard for the topics at hand.

    I have given you plenty of chances to state your positions but it is now obvious you only want to drive every thread into the ground with your constant trolling.

    If I read another comment that even remotely resembles a previous comment you have made, I will have no choice but to remove your further contributions from this site.

  70. Like I said before, why don’t you come clean and declare this is a propaganda site .  You may think this blog is to educate “ignorant” Americans  but in fact it is doing the opposite. 

    Just ask yourself what people see when they read this blog?  Nasty insults against the Americans/Irish/British by people who hold themselves to a holier than thou attitude while howling about French bashing [admin: warning, once again, do not confuse comments and the content of the site].  Thinly veiled anti-semitic remarks(* see below) (example : court jew and suppposed nefarious behaviors of court jews) which are given a free pass,  time and time again by the adminstration of this blog who claim to be holier than thou when it comes to “vilifying an entire peoples & cultures”. (** see below)

    Not to mention wild exaggerations and hyperbole about supposed French bashing in the US mainstream media now. We are not living in the pre-Iraq war years and it is ridiculous to keep on pretending that the same anti-French hysteria is still prevalent now. 

    Go ahead and “remove my contribution”…….again why the propaganda ? Why not tell the truth that you want to censor me . [read tos, the term “censor” is innapropriate]

    By the way,  gee I wonder why Freddy thinks I am Canadian.  Thanks a lot for keeping your word. [admin note: baseless accusation, once again]

    * [admin note: this is a dangerous accusation, one we don’t take lightly]
    ** [admin note: while we find the term questionable, the term court-jew (@jewishencyclopedia.com) is not considered a slur and is being used here to describe a contributors position in relation to other groups. If anybody can demonstrate the term is being used offensively, we will consider further action.]

  71. And how exactly is it being used to describe a contributor’s position? By attributing devious behavior traits  which are supposedly common in a “court jew” as in quote ….

    Court- jew methodology works in the interests of triumphalism; i.e., hitching  cause to that which is seen as “star player” to the scene”

    You know as well as I do that the above sentence would be prohibited by Canada’s hate laws and for a good reason.  It is playing on hateful stereotypes of Jews.

    Just substitute the word “French”  instead of “Jew” in the above sentence .  Or better still ask any Jewish person that you know personally how they feel about the “methodology” of court Jews described as such . No need to consult encyclopedias or don’t you know any Jewish persons?

    PS: On another matter I understand certain words are forbidden to be used in this site.  Sounds a lot like you know what. LOL

  72. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    So it’s banned now, right ?

  73. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    Miquelon, I can’t post my #67 message to @oxofamilydad in the appropriate thread.

    Is that thread locked ?

  74. André Wernesson says:

  75. Invoking “canadian hate-laws” is such an absolute red-herring that I have moved to ban the user from the site for the use of histrionics.

  76. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    That trollie was a closet French-hater who like many of her/his ilk can’t stand that places like miquelon.org exist.
    Those trolls have no problem whatsoever with anti-French bigotry (hell more often than not they are major perpetrators themselves) but say anything negative about their country in return and they go into hysterics.
    And they have the nerve to come here of all places and complain about American bashing. Completely surreal.

    Good riddance to bad rubbish.

  77. Emily (sharon) [Banned User] says:

    Where does it say histrionics is a bannable offense in the rules? Oh I see you just invented it to serve your purpose now. [admin note. Your messages over the last few weeks are rife with TOS violations: including repeated personal attacks, innuendo, repeated accusations of bias, repeated false accusations against the blog owner about disseminating personal information, accusations of racism, accusations of anti-semitism, fascism … ] [ … usual accusations of bias, etc … ]

    Instead of your usual propaganda and lies, why don’t you tell the truth why you actually banned me…because I expoesd the anti-semitism in Freddy’s remarks thereby proving how insenstive you are to “vilifying an entire peoples” when it comes to “others” who are not French.  [Wrong, see Fred’s (Midwest) explanation on why he used that expression which I personally would not use. You took the bait, line and sinker.]

    It may have also bought to light some uncomfortable truths about the garden variety anti-semitism found in some French Canadians. [admin note: who are you referring to as a “French Canadian”? As well, accusations of anti-Semitism are classic troll techniques one move away from a Godwin point. Such accusations are very serious] … common stereotyping of jews due to lack of personal contact with Jews personally . My remark about why consult encyclopedias, don’t you know any Jews personally must have hit a nerve.  [admin note: a comment so repugnant it does not dignify a response one other than to say I follow a strict policy of never ever getting involved in issues that deal with Israel/Palestine nor issues related to anti-Semitism, Zionism, anti-Zionism other than a profound acknowledgement of Europe’s heavy historical burden. I also refuse to take any position when it comes to current events because of the many friends I have in both communities. I also know too well how trolls like to steer any discussion towards those issues in the hope of creating an issue out of thin air.] [ … ].

    You hate the truth when the truth is not to your liking. Freddy’s remarks are anti-semitic , deal with it. [See Fred’s (Midwest) explanation].

    When another poster made a remark that the french folded quickly in WW2, you immediately censored it and banned him as well.  It is true the French folded in quickly , now deal with it instead of censoring and banning anybody who dare mentions that truth. [Wrong, he was immediately removed from the blog for using the nickname “Pétain”, an offensive choice designed to provoke and other offences. Nobody is questioning the historical record]. […]

  78. To Marc, Regarding the troll:  In an earlier post I had spoken of the troll, Sharon, as poisoning the well.  It had been my intention in follow-up replys aimed at her positioning(s) to expose anything of value   –in her counterposts–that one might “toy” with in the form of a rebuttal.  As you know and others came to learn, no amount of logic or pleas for consideration(s) had any effect on this woman; however, it could be conceived that she might fall prey to a . . . . . . rise  —shrill of tone and substance in reason, when correctly baited; viz, the use of a narrowism   –as court jew.  As was seen, the bait was to be eventually taken  —  becoming “stuck” in her throat.  In one of her posts I was likened to being “Hitler-minded” and the word “Nazi” was tossed around with abandon.  Finally, her terminal post was to tell it all   —as did you response, for which thanks are expressed.  As the philosopher would say, Give Them Enough Rope and They Will Hang Themselves . . .

  79. Emily (Sharon) says:

    Oh so you delibrately used hateful stereotyping of Jews to quote “bait” me ?  

    I suppose it is ok to use hateful stereotyping of the French as “bait” as well.

    Thanks for exposing your mindset that it is okay to bait others with stereotyping of an “entire peoples & culture”.

    Your desperate attempt to explain your bait techniques has only further exposed your mindset. 

    One would have hoped that those who are at the receiving end of  insidious stereotyping will be more sensitive to the issue of stereotyping and especially if used in a cavalier manner as bait, it shows an utter lack of insensitivity towards “others” who are not French. 

    Judging by the administrations lack of reprimind of your bait techniques it shows clearly that they were not concerned at all of the possiblity of Jewish persons reading your remarks about “court Jews”. it seems they have the same insensitivity towards “others” who are not French….while claiming to hold holier than thou attitudes about “vilifying an entire peoples”.

    As for all those accusations thrown as the reasons…first the reason was histrionics. When it was pointed out that the rules don’t mention histrionics as a bannable offense ….different reason is now given.
    As for that long list of accusations about me., I can say the same about so many other posters here.  But as we all  know…viva la double standard and hypocrisy which this blog is famous for.

    PS:  Canadian hate laws don’t give a free pass to hateful stereotyping to be used as bait. In fact it might even be a greater offense .

  80. Let’s put an end to this non-issue. We consulted several jewish scholars and were provided the following response:

    “We believe the usage which it is put to today, can be likened to calling a black man an “Uncle Tom” – but perhaps not as severe.”

    “The history behind the term, is that in Europe before Jews were emancipated, they were treated worse than serfs. There were some Jews, through wealth or other reasons, managed to ingratiate themselves with the local rulers. They would often intercede on behalf of their brethren, when some particular nasty plan was about to be launched against the Jews. Sometimes these Jews were perceived as playing into the hands of these rulers. Thus the term “court-Jew” initialy was just a fact, whereas now it has other connotations.”

    It is therefore clear the term is not anti-semitic and cannot be construed as so. In fact, it has been used in political discourse in such newspapers as the Jerusalem Post and the Jewish Advocate.

    It is however a personal attack and does fall under the TOS, I therefore ask it not be used henceforth. End of issue.

  81. Barney hasn't left the building says:

    Hopefully, this will sink his career

  82. I read somewhere that many writers are very upset with the whole 10 pm block being given up to Leno. So many shows like Law & Order and other dramas are now pushed back to 9 and others got cut. A drama show is lots of producing, writing etc – and here comes Leno and his usually tin pot and wooden spoon act.

    Anyway, can’t wait to get the documentary together. Thanks VG, BD, PST and SK if you’re reading this ! 🙂 You’re awesome !

  83. To Miquelon:
    Should either of these characters, Leno or Conan, return to French bashing, planned measures in/of response should be in the offing. One measure among others might be considered, to wit:  Being an orderly, live-show, walk-on by a small party  —  of identity by arm-band [tri-color w/FFI ? (the arm-band tells it all !)].  Security would, of course, intervene in this instance(s) for learning cause; this, prior to escorting  said party off the premises. We can deduce that “physical action”  –as such, opposed to mere “re-action” from a provided  literature-learning source might elucidate the offender to a fuller extent; again, it must be asked if anything other than a fist-in-the-face serves purpose.
    Would be good to hear from you; also, from Barney, Andre, Fred Orth and others.

  84. When another poster made a remark that the french folded quickly in WW2, you immediately censored it and banned him as well.  It is true the French folded in quickly , now deal with it instead of censoring and banning anybody who dare mentions that truth. [Wrong, he was immediately removed from the blog for using the nickname “Pétain”, an offensive choice designed to provoke and other offences. Nobody is questioning the historical record]. […]


    5
    Rocket Says: Your comment is awaiting moderation.
    August 15th, 2009 at 7:22 pm
    On the other hand the French only say that in response to “We saved yer ass in WWII so shut up!” so…
    well didn’t you fold during WWII quite rapidly?
    keep it up Marc!  You sir are a liar
    I save all of your posts

  85. I think that we can expect the more subtle  bashing to exist for awhile. The “humor” impact is a bit out of vogue to be too aggessive.  I like Fred (Midwest) idea but timing is everything and, unless someone becomes clearly aggressive in bashing, we would look like “poor sports” if we make an issue out of petty slurs. Just saying……….

  86. Watching Leno right now. Same old same old. Fred Midwest, you are correct, we need to be ready to act. At this point, I don’t expect any French Bashing from Leno as he’s moved on – yet never apologized.

    French Bashing in this day and age remains a low level, pop culture event. Restons vigilants.

  87. I just found this great article about my islands that references this site called “Recollections of a Vagabonde“:

    Now I’ll talk about something my French speaking readers may not be aware of (if they live outside the USA.) Last year while I was researching information about Miquelon island on the Net I found a site called “Miquelon.org” and thinking it was about the island I started reading it. It is not a tourism site but called “The Fighting French” […]

    I had forgotten about Miquelon.org but researching for my post this week I found it again and this is why I thought to write about all this. I just would add that the people I know here in the United States do not have anti-French sentiments; it is just a vocal minority of uninformed people who believe in bad stereotypes.

    Source : http://avagabonde.blogspot.com

  88. Excellent article that SuperFrenchie published on his Facebook this morning :

    When Americans go to Italy, they’ll meet fifty nice people and run into one jerk . . . and they’ll think wow, what a jerk, and then forget it. When Americans go to France, they’ll run into fifty nice people and then run into one jerk . . . and they’ll think aha, finally France shows its true face.
    Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/mlasalle/detail?&entry_id=47375#ixzz0RBzxYIJh

  89. ‘Jay Leno Show’ Premieres: Reviewers Slam Lame Comedy Bits, Unfunny Monologue

    Most critics agreed the episode was very similar to his work on the “Tonight Show” but that the celebrity guests felt more forced.

  90. I just don’t see this Leno idea working in the major media markets. His writers will put everybody to sleep.

  91. To Miquelon: Should either of these characters, Leno or Conan, return to French bashing, planned measures in/of response should be in the offing. One measure among others might be considered, to wit:  Being an orderly, live-show, walk-on by a small party  —  of identity by arm-band [tri-color w/FFI ? (the arm-band tells it all !)].  Security would, of course, intervene in this instance(s) for learning cause; this, prior to escorting  said party off the premises. We can deduce that “physical action”  –as such, opposed to mere “re-action” from a provided  literature-learning source might elucidate the offender to a fuller extent; again, it must be asked if anything other than a fist-in-the-face serves purpose. Would be good to hear from you; also, from Barney, Andre, Fred Orth and others.

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